Curse

Morganas · Aug 23, 2005, 12:51 AM // 00:51

I'm having trouble dealing with spike damage with my current mo/me monk build, using the skills hex breaker, healing touch, orison, healing hands, healing seed, dwaynas kiss, drain enchant, and a res spell. I have no energy problems, or problems keeping people alive against normal teams, it's just the darn spikers. I also think that my healing seed is getting stripped against the first spike target in most cases.

My last build, a boon protector with energy drain as elite, easily protected from spike damage, but had severe energy problems, and couldn't deal with NR well.

Is there some happy medium where I can both defend from spike and do regular healing against other sorts of teams?

Btw, this is for 8 player maps, the build can actually handle spike from 4 player teams (though it's still a close call usually).

knives · Aug 23, 2005, 01:17 AM // 01:17

Bring a prot monk running low casting time enchants. (RoF + Prot Spirit ftw). Even with NR down 1/4 - 1/2 cast times doesn't really devstate it. Also if you are really scared of spirit teams bring signet of devotion, all the cool kids are doing it. Mend ailment + martyr anyone?

Morganas · Aug 23, 2005, 01:21 AM // 01:21

My problem with the protector is I can't heal effectively without divine boon, and then I have energy problems against a normal team. Also, alot of spirit teams use that +hp spirit that makes prot spirit completely worthless, and they tend to have lots of "machine gun" rangers that run well under NR, making RoF useless too.

Syno Nym · Aug 23, 2005, 01:40 AM // 01:40

A protector isn't supposed to heal, it's supposed to "protect" as its name indicates. That means Prot spirit, Mend ailment, Reversal, Smite hex or Remove hex or Inspire hex, Aegis, etc... All that can PREVENT your mates to take damage.

I tried playing with boon a few times, but I definitly think it's not that great for a prot.

smurfhunter · Aug 23, 2005, 02:05 AM // 02:05

this is a leetle bit off topic but ive had similar problems in 4-4 team arenas.

watch as i smoothly transition into my problems...

as the only monk on a 4-4 team, duh everyone runs after me and its quite the circus. only problem is i die in like 10 seconds. any suggestion/builds which can theoretically survive against an onslought of like 2 warriors and a caster? (please no uw builds... im sick of those)

oh and you have to be able to heal as well

Morganas · Aug 23, 2005, 03:03 AM // 03:03

Hex breaker, healing touch, and orison is all I need to stay alive, that and a good deal of running. If you're up against warriors, run, long before they can catch you. It REALLY helps to have a snare character on your team for this.

If you start out far back from your group, if you get targeted, you can force even the elementalists to chase you and waste time. If the other team's chasing you, you don't need to heal anyone else. Also, make sure your warrior knows that you won't follow them into battle, and will run to you if they need healing.

smurfhunter · Aug 23, 2005, 03:05 AM // 03:05

thats what i *try* to do.... only i once met this dude who did like 100 damage a hit with a hammer and knocked me down to the point where i was doing situps.

ouch

Morganas · Aug 23, 2005, 04:12 AM // 04:12

Going protection for pacifism can be a temporary fix, but this is where your teamates come into play.

Earth ele for wards, air ele for blind, water for slow, illusion mesmer, curses necs, even other hammer warriors can all potentially counter high damage warriors. Warriors are the most devastating class in the game if left unchecked, so make sure you have some good anti-warrior skills on your team, and don't just group with damage oriented characters.

Having a nec on your side can deal with your warrior problems entirely, to find one, ask for curses necs, then when they join, ask them if they're good at dealing damage. If they say yes, boot them and find another.

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 23, 2005, 04:20 AM // 04:20

What's a monk's second class for again?

Oh yeah, to trick the enemy team into thinking you have more than just monk only skills...

*note sarcasm...*

Rossaroni · Aug 23, 2005, 06:07 AM // 06:07

What kind of spiking? Air ele spiking? Signet spikers? Regardless, what you need is bigger heals. Heal other, healing seed, word of healing (why would you use healing hands anyways?), and then just spam. You shouldn't be the only monk on an 8-man team. At least there should one more healing monk.

Anyways, I suggest finding a way to prevent or buffer damage instead of trying to match the damage with healing. Tip: winter.

Fr3sH · Aug 23, 2005, 07:05 AM // 07:05

Spell breaker

Vermilion Okeanos · Aug 23, 2005, 07:32 AM // 07:32

If you don't want to use enchantment because of NR... then stances are the next in line... try out some stances such as mantra of lightning and dryder's defense.

If you are talking about a well coordinated obsidian flame... your chance of blocking that without enchantment are... praticaly none.

smurfhunter · Aug 23, 2005, 07:58 AM // 07:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rossaroni

What kind of spiking? Air ele spiking? Signet spikers? Regardless, what you need is bigger heals. Heal other, healing seed, word of healing (why would you use healing hands anyways?), and then just spam. You shouldn't be the only monk on an 8-man team. At least there should one more healing monk.

Anyways, I suggest finding a way to prevent or buffer damage instead of trying to match the damage with healing. Tip: winter.

this is 4-4 team arenas. and it was a warrior with a hammer bigger than me.

and uh... correct me if im wrong but winter works on elemental damage, and monks dont have that special defense against it unlike rangers.

and see the problem with asking your teamates to help you is that they just turn around and laugh at you because the enemy team ganked you in about 10 seconds >.<

and i am a mo/n with offering of blood, any good blood prots?

and all the heals you mentioned wont work on me, and its all about me in this post

thats what i hate about 4-4, the monk has to be a prot, heal, warrior, etc.

im going on strike

Zeru · Aug 23, 2005, 08:05 AM // 08:05

Infuse Health and Divine Intervention are two of the better anti-spike spells out there due to the 1/4 second cast and rather large heal. Infuse Health is absolutely terrible in terms of energy efficient healing unless you are an el/mo with 14 estorage, ether renewal, and aura of restoration. Divine Intervention is not that great but it has uses, especially under QZ.

Vs a good air spike team you will have no chance to stop the spike unless you are using fertile. The key to those matchups is getting your monks ressed and outlasting them.

I've been messing around in random arena lately and the two builds that have worked decently well are an aura of faith healer and a prot booner. On the AoF user I rarely have to switch to my second focus since 160 health sig devos are extremely good. The prot booner offers good damage mitigation but energy is quite taking even with energy drain as energy management.

Give this a try if nothing else works in random arena:

16 DF
10+1 HP
8 Insp

Aura of Faith {E}
Orison
Healing Touch
Hex Breaker (must-have in arena)
Heal Other
Inspired Hex/Channeling
Signet of Devotion
Healing Seed/Divine Intervention/Channeling

DI is halfway decent here because you don't have reversal and therefore cannot stop a good hammer chain with anything else besides prot spirit (only have time for 1/4s casts in between dev hammer and heavy/hammer). lvl 16 DI with AoF on you is a 380 hp or so heal which is a huge help when you're the lone monk facing a hammer.

Ender Ward · Aug 23, 2005, 08:07 AM // 08:07

Protective Spirit is your friend. You don't need to be a "Protector" monk to use it. Simply having 9 ranks in Protection Prayers and using a 20% longer enchants staff gets you 19 seconds duration. That's way more than necessary, especially taking into account NR spamming with Oath Shot + QZ.

Ofcourse if you meet a 'good' spike team that coordinates NR/Lingering/Rend with their spike, then nothing short of being clairvoyant with Spell Breaker, or using Fertile Season is going to save you. Nothing realistic, atleast (Mantra of Frost on a Monk + Winter need not apply).

So your best bet is to have Protective Spirit yourself and to have a Ranger on a team with Fertile Season.

Schorny · Aug 23, 2005, 08:07 AM // 08:07

If you go down to fast, try some things to protect you.
For example protective spirit (may be cast from another char), armor of earth, kinetic armor, balanced stance, some defense stance like dryders or something, have someone life bond you and/or life barrier you...

just a few ideas

look through all the other classes defense skills and see if anything can fit you...

smurfhunter · Aug 23, 2005, 08:27 AM // 08:27

my biggest problem with that i guess is that i have to funnel about 9 attribs into blood magic to get my offering of blood to work. i.e. no prot for me.

anyone know some good energy management skills with a heal/diving/prot attrib?

meh i guess ill just look in teh database. thanks for the advice tho

EmperorTippy · Aug 23, 2005, 08:48 AM // 08:48

Bring a protection monk and you bring protective spirit with only whatever left over attribute points that you have in protection. If your up against a NR-Spike team that is corrdinated extremly well then nothing short of a mirical will allow you to live (5 chain lighting right as NR drops anyone? Only MAntra of Frost+Winter will save you then. Usally though the team isn't that cordinated so as soon as you see NR drop put up Protective spirit. Chances are that if a spike is coming you will block it even if protective spirt only lasts 6 seconds.

Schorny · Aug 23, 2005, 09:10 AM // 09:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by smurfhunter

anyone know some good energy management skills with a heal/diving/prot attrib?

for example: Signet of devotion, peace and harmony, devine spirit

NIB · Aug 23, 2005, 10:00 AM // 10:00

Why try to coordinate nr, when you can use rend enchanments or lingering and do the same thing but easier? Anyway if you are having problem with spike teams, use oathshot+fertile+qz ftw. Not to mention that you can easily interupt 1-2 spikers and thus pretty much make the enemy useless(since their spike wont be enough to instantly kill 1 of your allies). Spike teams are like so 2 months ago.

Quote:

Signet of devotion, peace and harmony, devine spirit

Peace and harmony is useless since it will be removed easily by nr or whatever. Divine spirit is semiuseless with the 60sec recharge. Only use divine spirit if your team is using qz. Sig of dev is very good. Watch for primal echoes though and dont use it when its up. And personally, i would advise you to either go prot or healer and go for inspiration. For example go mo/me and get 12 healing, 12 divine, 10 inspiration. Get energy drain and inspired hex. Here is a typical generic healer monk build for tombs

1. Orizon
2. Signet of devotion
3. Heal other
4. Healing touch
5. Heal area/heal party or whatever
6. Inspired hex(or some other hex removal or hex breaker or whatever)
7. Energy drain
8. Healing seed